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Discussion Starter #1
There are companies who live through innovation and companies who live through others innovation. If Harley Davidson is the former than Victory is the latter.

Victory just launched the Gunner, which is a bobber style cruiser expected to compete hotly with Harley. Victory has long been pleased to copy tried and true harley formulas which inspires this thought.

How long if at all would you think until we see a Victory positioned at the low point of the market toface the HD Street 500 and 750 head on?

I mean the Price point of the Street 750 undercuts the closest Victory cruiser by about half.
 

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There are companies who live through innovation and companies who live through others innovation. If Harley Davidson is the former than Victory is the latter.

Victory just launched the Gunner, which is a bobber style cruiser expected to compete hotly with Harley. Victory has long been pleased to copy tried and true harley formulas which inspires this thought.

How long if at all would you think until we see a Victory positioned at the low point of the market toface the HD Street 500 and 750 head on?

I mean the Price point of the Street 750 undercuts the closest Victory cruiser by about half.
The first couple years, the "classic" Victorys were copies of HD, and ugly ones at that. However, when they started making the Vegas model, they strayed away from HD styling, and made a nice looking bike. Better looking than most HD big twin models (IMO).

The Gunner is another big bike with a big engine (106 ci), so I would not consider it to be competition with the Street, especially with a price starting at $13k.
I wish they would make a smaller (engine) bike, I might consider buying one. Maybe if the HD Street is a big hit.....
 

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The first couple years, the "classic" Victorys were copies of HD, and ugly ones at that. However, when they started making the Vegas model, they strayed away from HD styling, and made a nice looking bike. Better looking than most HD big twin models (IMO).

The Gunner is another big bike with a big engine (106 ci), so I would not consider it to be competition with the Street, especially with a price starting at $13k.
I wish they would make a smaller (engine) bike, I might consider buying one. Maybe if the HD Street is a big hit.....
+1:D
 

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Discussion Starter #6
The first couple years, the "classic" Victorys were copies of HD, and ugly ones at that. However, when they started making the Vegas model, they strayed away from HD styling, and made a nice looking bike. Better looking than most HD big twin models (IMO).

The Gunner is another big bike with a big engine (106 ci), so I would not consider it to be competition with the Street, especially with a price starting at $13k.
I wish they would make a smaller (engine) bike, I might consider buying one. Maybe if the HD Street is a big hit.....
Absolutely. I mean the gunner is more an answer to the VROD if anything. My point with the OP was do you think Victory will move them selves down to the range of the Street 500 and 750, I mean its a genuine Harley that undercuts their entire lineup...
 

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I suspect the competition to the Street from Polaris will be badged as an Indian, perhaps are revival of the Scout.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Jaysus, this is NOT ABOUT THE GUNNER. The Gunner was an example to frame the question....


@Desert Tortoise I completely forgot Polaris has Indian as well. That not a bad thought either about the scout reincarnate.

 

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Looks like Pigtory has the Harley thing down, make a dozen models by stirring the parts in the parts bin. Yawn. They should call that POS the "9-Ball".

Btw, if Indian makes a Scout as large and heavy as that red S&S/Hardly clone thing in the photo, well, that is no competitor for the Street. Waaaaayyy to big and heavy.
 

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Polaris seems intent on bigger bikes with both Victory and Indian. Everybody always wants the biggest and baddest right?... maybe not.
HD obviously sees value in manufacturing a smaller more technologically advanced bike. I suspect Polaris will be watching the Street sales closely. Maybe they will follow suit, who knows.
But at least we have one option for a smaller displacement bike from a US manufacturer.
 

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The story Polaris put out when they announced the purchase of the Indian name was that Indian branded bikes would not be restricted to big cruiser things.

Here is a link to a Cycle World article on the subject, along with a couple of quotes from that article that hint, to me at least, that Indian isn't going to remain strictly a brand of large expensive cruisers.

Indian Motorcycles Purchased by Polaris Industries- Motorcycle News

“Polaris will utilize its well-known strengths in engineering, manufacturing, and distribution to complete the mission we undertook upon re-launching the brand in 2006: to harness the enormous potential of the Indian brand. Polaris is the most logical owner of Indian Motorcycle. Indian’s heritage brand will allow Polaris to aggressively compete across an expanded spectrum of the motorcycle market.”

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Meanwhile, a team of engineers and designers are hard at work at Polaris deciding just what the next Indian will be. “Is it a big V-Twin or could it be something else?” asks Blackwell. “We know as a company we need a broader line going forward, maybe smaller bikes for younger customers. How should we stretch Indian? Should it be stretched at all or just stay big V-Twins? That’s all still to be addressed. One thing we’re not going to do is rush this, we’re going to do it right.”
 

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I think Victory uses the same engine in all its bikes. Given that, its hard for them to easily move up or down market since they would have to build an entire new engine. I'm guessing that is the main thing preventing them from moving down market.
 

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I think Victory uses the same engine in all its bikes. Given that, its hard for them to easily move up or down market since they would have to build an entire new engine. I'm guessing that is the main thing preventing them from moving down market.
No. Polaris used a clean sheet new engine design for Indian. The Victory 106 ci engine is overhead cam while the bigger 111 engine in the current Indians is a brand new (yet already ancient) pushrod engine.
 

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Thanks for the interesting article DT.
Maybe there is hope for a smaller bike from Polaris. The current line of Indians do nothing for me, any more than HD's baggers and dressers do. If Indian will build smaller displacement bikes, I hope they use a clean slate and not their current designs. I would think Victory would be a better fit to get away from the ancient "standard" designs to something that flows a little more.
Case in point, I liked the VRod when it came it out, and I like the style of the new Street very much. Funny part is that the old HD diehard air-cooled-only bunch hate both with a passion. To each, their own I guess.
 

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Well the GUnner is one of Victorys cheapest motorcycles

SO if not the Gunner.. There is no competitor to the Street from Victory.
 

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I think the competition from Polaris will heat up, but I don't think the Street's rival will be ready until 2015 or 2016. The 111" Indian engine is a beautiful design, great for what
it is meant for, a full-size touring bike.... But Indian was also known for it's sporty Scout!... It took Polaris a lot of time & capital investment to create the 111, I can only bet they are investing in a smaller (750) engine design that will do the Scout name proud!
 

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Thanks for the interesting article DT.
Maybe there is hope for a smaller bike from Polaris. The current line of Indians do nothing for me, any more than HD's baggers and dressers do. If Indian will build smaller displacement bikes, I hope they use a clean slate and not their current designs. I would think Victory would be a better fit to get away from the ancient "standard" designs to something that flows a little more.
Case in point, I liked the VRod when it came it out, and I like the style of the new Street very much. Funny part is that the old HD diehard air-cooled-only bunch hate both with a passion. To each, their own I guess.
Funny and true. When I roll up at the Harley dealer on my trusty old BMW K bike to buy parts or kick tires, bandanaheads will talk to me, even a few admire the bike. They flip when they see the odometer, over 293K miles.

But when I roll up on the Street Rod, you would think from the reaction I had just unzipped my fly and shook my weenie at everyone. Silence and eyes averted from .... this .... uh .... thing .... they refuse to acknowledge came out a Harley Davidson plant. I have been told it "isn't a Harley", even it "isn't American". Sigh. This is the sad fact the aspiring new Street owner will face when shopping and subsequently owning a Street 500 or 750. If you can deal with that, it is probably a fine motorcycle.

Just tell the old grandpaws that you'll be riding your Street when they are pushing their walkers around making potato-potato noises.
 
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